voting for bad images

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i think folks are voting for lesser quality images to improve their odds of winning....since we can see those we duel against its kinda obvious, is my work perfect NO, but no way a blurry poorly composed shot should beat a good composition that is sharp and appealing.....i don't understand...is there a way for admin to see this too? seems a bit unfair to me....
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denise johnson

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Posted 8 years ago

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Michelle Meenawong

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... and also: I never see an answer of any of these cheating people. Do they know they are safe and can continue cheating because nobody will warn them or delete their accounts ???
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denise johnson

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and now those who upgrade get more duels (without having to vote in duels) so what are the odds of those pics doing better cause they have more opportunities (probably why some folks will pay) so those with the money will win more often i am guessing, forget the algorithm stuff.....but alas i am still here, lol
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Janette Fraser

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I was a very naughty girl recently. I entered some rebellious photoshopped work (in the spirit of Andy Warhol) into the 'tin can' competition, just to see whether they were paying attention... after all - there has been a LOT of work that has gotten by and won awards... for instance: those rotating circular works and the fake sillouttes and the ones with the sun bursts than aren't from the real sun, and the phoney sunsets.... need I go on? I dare say that I do not. :-)

But I'm happy to see that less than 48 hours went by before I was finally moved to a proper photoshop category. Well... I did get quite high in the points first... lol. This is a win for the Pixoto community is it not?

Maybe....

Maybe not.....

You see - my images were flagrant abuses but other images win because they are subtle ones that - even though we know they are photoshoped to hell and back - look as if they have a 1.0% chance of being real. Even though when you consider the entire portfolio of the artist it becomes apparent they are definitely not.

Yet even though I report these images - Pixoto takes no notice.

Was I in danger of winning an award? Well - dammit all to hell - I should do anyway for being an unappreciated whistle blower that's been driven to these lengths to make a point!

I like it that I got took down. Hooray! I don't like it that other devils get by, by being subtle little devils that get the masters pat on the head and BIG rankings due to their chicanery too.

No - I won't name names. We all know who they are. Don't we?

93's A.
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Making Memories Photography

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Give me a break, you are a expert on fake silhouette's, or fake sunset pictures. what makes you such and expert? Or do I dare ask.
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Brandon Rechten

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I did a similar experiment a while back. I uploaded a b&w image into the architecture category, which did terribly. It got a little over 500pts, and didn't even make it into the top 20% for the day.

Then I took the same exact image, applied some fake sunset colors to it, re-uploaded and voila! 680+ pts and #2 in the category for the day.

Needless to say, I'm fast becoming disillusioned.
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Christina Santiago

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I think points should not decrease on photo's that way all points earned are kept and it would make it harder to get top photos knocked down in rank due to people voting on bad photos to get higher in ranks
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Beth Chepote

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WInning doesn't mean a durned thing if it isn't achieved honestly!
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gaiafrique

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hear hear!!
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West Eal

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If you're not malaysian then you're not winning!
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Eko Suhartono

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refers to the statement of mr. Jason number "2", if I do not misunderstand, I agree on many things, but not 100% correct. Why is that, if an image has high rankings to this day, for example, but there is one image that just submitted today with a much better quality of the image that have the high rankings, of course I would choose the new submitted image, and then you catch me???? woooow. If so woe to the latter submitted image because it may not get to the high score.
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Jean Luc Julien

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And if the vote was not anonymous?
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Susan England

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In response to the guaranteed 100 duels for going pro being an advantage, it isn't always. I have photos that have actually dropped in score because they were kept in the dueling pool. The knife cuts both ways.

I just went pro because I am nosy and want to see exactly which pictures I am losing to.
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Steve BB

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I totally agree with you Susan - and if honesty prevails we will have photos reaching a certain level then perhaps +/- a few places then stay on that plateau.

I have to admit I have lost to some really poor examples and also won on images that imho I should not have they were infinitely better than mine.

I am guessing - random clicking :(

Steve
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Susan England

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Or drinking while dueling, or 8 year old kids are voting, hence the kitten and stuffed rabbit photo beating out the technically brilliant photo. Who knows? People are unpredictable.
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West Eal

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I agree 100% I see dog shit winning over great work all the time! It seems if there is a fishers net or a malaysian girl in the pic you get a score of 600 plus. This site is bull shit!!
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Christina Santiago

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Agree 100% as well, no longer post on Pixoto
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Making Memories Photography

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Steve: You also have people who solicit votes from family and friends who are registered just to vote and do so continuously, It is the main reason for loosing to images that truly look like they have been taken with a point and shoot, a snapshot.There are some amazing photos on here and some very artistic work that deserve votes. Whether taken straight from the camera, which if shot in raw is impossible, raw images have to be put through the lab. Composite's are artistic and hard to do and deserve votes as well, it is usually two shots that are combined, which can also be done in a dark room with chemicals.
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Steve BB

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I never even thought of that - a really good point you have brought up.
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gaiafrique

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don't be so hasty to knock point and shoots hah hah hah! All my pics are with a 10 year old 3.1MP Olympus or a five-year old Canon powershot (both point and shoots) and get me quite a few creds nonetheless. The difference comes in composition and a genuine interest in photography. The issue of folks who solicit votes is that once those votes "dry up" the voting continues again. So - if you have a great image, you might not win "pic of the day" but it might well be pic of the week or month. The idiots who solicit votes won't last long.
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Jestferlaffs

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I cannot help thinking that as an open site that we all joined without andone twisting our arm we have to take the votes as they come. If you know you have a great shot then thats who is important. The people who want to purchase these images will know what they are looking for and your shots will stand up by themselves. The voting is less about who is better than someone else, its a personal preference and you cannot take that away from people and punish them because you dont think picture a is better than picture b. Freedom.
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West Eal

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I agree 100% I see dog shit winning over great work all the time! It seems if there is a fishers net or a malaysian girl in the pic you get a score of 600 plus. This site is bull shit!!
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Susan England

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I wouldn't say it is bullshit, I love the site but I do have to laugh about the fishers net because it is totally true. That and the old man smoking in profile. LOL.
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Daniel Boavida

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Again the Same Thing, voting for Bad Images, Just Watch the Duel history.

Just Watch the Duel history

http://www.pixoto.com/images-photogra...
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Angel Whisenant

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled vent about voting.....what in the world is going on?.

I guess this is just a vent...I haven't been on this site for a year and now I fully understand why I left----really??? HOW does this work??? someone please explain this to me

My image
http://www.pixoto.com/images-photogra...

Lost to this:
http://www.pixoto.com/images-photogra...
AND
http://www.pixoto.com/images-photogra...

The last one made my laugh.......I'm not great---but no where near the same caliber. I guess I'll end my rant now
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Scott Murphy, Official Rep

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Don't be distracted by a few votes. Sometimes people vote foolishly. See my comment below.
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Scott Murphy, Official Rep

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Votes are submitted by real people. Real people have different opinions on what is a good image. Real people make mistakes. Even some real people intentionally do what most considered as wrong. Unfortunately, this is human nature.

That being said, our voting system understands human nature. Our voting system keeps track of how people vote and if they vote for obviously bad images or if the vote against the norms, the amount of impact their vote has becomes nothing.

You are going to see votes in your duel history that do not make any sense. They might even make the opposite of sense, but if you didn't see that, you would know that something is wrong and perhaps, the votes are not made by real people. If anything, it should tell you the system does work. It is the collection of votes over time and by whom that determine the image score.

Don't get distracted by old comments. We have made a lot of changes to the system over the past 6 years. When we first introduced the system, there was no way of detecting bad votes or normalizing them out.
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Ciprian Apetrei

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Who votes for this kind of photo?.

Sometimes when I see pictures like this I doubt that all the votes are submited with good faith. How can this get a reward?! How can someone actually vote for this? Also it is so obvoiusly misscategoriez it made me think it was submited as a joke, to test the seriousness of the other voters. Just a thought, what do you think about it?

http://www.pixoto.com/images-photogra...
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Scott Murphy, Official Rep

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Official Response
You see every vote in your duel history. 1% of all votes are people that are trying to cheat or just vote poorly. The reliability score of these users is zero and their votes have no impact on your image score. We have various ways to detect if a user is voting maliciously. We have users that get banned every day for voting unfairly.

The key to a quality image is time. Time filters our bad behavior.

While our system has worked quite well (You can see quality images at the top of every category), we will be rolling out our next iteration of our Duel System next quarter. This will allow further moderation from the community as well as add various safe guards to further improve the overall system.

Update 11/22/18: We have ensured that a user can not see the same image more than once. The current (2.0) system now guarantees that.

1. if a voter votes poorly, their duels will not count. Currently 5% of all duels fall in this category.

2. A voter can not vote on your image more than once.

I am sure everyone will enjoy Duel System 3.0. I will notify everyone once it has been released.
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William Lee

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I have a suggestion for Duel System 3.0. See my reply to this thread.
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William Lee

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Hi Scott:

Why not utilize the power of the "inverting voter"?
If a voter votes frequently, you may secretly and periodically give him/her some check-point pairs of images which are obviously poor vs good quality. This is the method to detect an "inverting voter". If he/she consistently LOVE those poor pictures, then you secretly mark he/she as "inverting voter", and secretly plug an inverter to fully utilize his/her voting power. Don't waste human power.

William
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Jasenka, Official Rep

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Hello William, we have for 5 years now system that will flag and ban voters who have suspicious or seemingly careless voting patterns - please check this topic: http://community.pixoto.com/pixoto/to...