IMDb's policy is transphobic and harmful and it needs to change

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I understand that IMDb wishes to remain accurate, but their current policy most certainly needs to be changed, as it can be dangerous to some actors. As an actor, I believe that an actor’s feelings should come before “accuracy.” Actors are real people with real feelings and real experiences. Transgender actors exist, as do actors who have suffered an abusive past. 

I can understand connecting “typos” to the same name, as I wouldn’t care so much if I was connected to “Rory Roach” or “Rory Roache,” etc. However, the name in question, which I will NOT be typing again because the very sight of it makes me PHYSICALLY ILL, is from a part of my life that in keeping it plastered on my IMDb credits, puts me in great danger. I will not and should not have to explain my personal life in order to have this name removed. I simply expect this request to be understood. I’ll explain in more detail. 

As I said, transgender actors exist. Some, in fact, have acted since before coming out as transgender, and some have been out since before IMDb even existed. That said, transgender people face many dangers. Forcing them to be known as a name that they don’t associate with could out them and in turn, result in their murder. Your policy forces this, and therefore, in that case, should be held responsible for any murder committed because of this. I’m sure you don’t want that. Furthermore, it can and does cause them harm to see a name they never wanted in the first place. 

As for abuse survivors, forcing this alternate name could result in the actor’s abuser finding them and causing more harm. Do you wish to cause harm to the actor? 

I’ve been more than patient with this issue. I’ve expressed how seeing this name, attributed to a very bad part of my life, makes me feel. I understand you wish to give accurate information, but it will not hurt someone to be a little confused by different credits. It does, however, hurt me greatly every single time I see this name. 

I’ve offered the solution of deleting, but as I had to fight tooth and nail for a credit in the first place, from abusive directors, I’ve opted to keep my credit. However, the solution now is to mark it uncredited. Accept this solution. This is no longer a request. You are hurting me and I believe that my feelings and my health come before “accuracy.” The “alternate name” is no longer connected to any existing human, and certainly not to me, so in truth, regardless of film credit, your forceful policy is creating the largest inaccuracy. This alternate name does not exist. Listing me as [uncredited] is a solution for both of us. The alternate name doesn’t exist, and Rory J. Roche did not receive credits despite participating in the film. I’ve already expressed that Savior never made it to DVD, so I cannot provide “proof” of any credit. 

I also deleted credits that I do not want. I want nothing to do with the three credits due to personal trauma to do with the show. Things happened that I do not need to discuss, but I do not want to be known for these things. 

Please reconsider your policy, and make it safe for actors that do not fit into your tiny boxes. And while you’re at it, please add more genders to the list. Not everyone is male or female. Intersex people exist. Transgender, nonbinary, genderfluid, and agender actors exist. If you’re confused about a pronoun to use, provide a slot in which the actor in question can tell you their pronoun. Simple. 

Thank you, 
Rory J. Roche

This is what I had posted to IMDb support. They accepted the change to uncredited, however, they have since changed it back to a name that I do not associate with and it's sickening. I am absolutely sick of this battle. I only want to be credited as Rory J. Roche, or uncredited, or simply not credited at all. Their constant issue with this is transphobic and disgusting. At this point, it is harassment. They're forcing me to use a name that isn't mine. They need to fix this and they need to make it more trans friendly. The actor and their feelings/health/safety should come before "accuracy."
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Rory Roche

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Posted 3 years ago

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Twintalks A life in the fag lane

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Everyone should be respected. IMDB step your game up. Trans people exist and have feelings just like you. Imagine if this was your family or child. Get over yourself and give trans people the respect they deserve!
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Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

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Hello, Rory.
 
Is that your page? 

Unfortunately, IMDb is a database which covers factual information about films and people involved. If you were credited by this name in your previous works, then filmography should display that. Likely the name could have been added by people who have seen the film, discovered the difference in the credits and did the right thing by correcting the listings according to the credits. However if you were not listed by that name on any title, that should indeed be removed and "(uncredited)" attribute should be instated.  

IMDb's policy is not in any way transphobic. It is quite progressive. It's just that IMDb collects factual information, which should be preserved, because it is plastered all over the film. Even if changed, it will eventually be corrected by someone, because movies are watched and people are re-checking end credits from time to time. A good example of a transgender person's page (in my humble opinion) is Alexis Arquette

That said, there are indeed problems with that. I won't pretend that I have full understanding of such situations, but I will try to help in any way I can.   
(Edited)
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Emma Arpin

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Credits can be updated and so can policies. The current policy willfully ignores how third parties can, and do, use information provided on the site to discriminate trans people in employment, housing, and their social life.

The policy is also at odds with Amazon's recent statement of support for the trans community. Amazon signed on a letter with other tech companies this fall, that said “What harms transgender people harms our companies.”
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Kati Knitt

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IMDb's policy is not in any way transphobic.
Any page that excuses deadnaming with "facts" is trans discriminating. "Factual information" should not stand above the well being of trans actors.
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Ken Hymes

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If imdb is progressive... why does it allow christians to engage in gay bashing, but censor posts which attempt to warn viewers of transphobic content? I tried several times to post a content warning on an episode of Touch of Frost. Nothing in the guidelines is applicable to my review. Social conservatives relentlessly include political and socially reactionary observations. I scrupulously avoided this in my second attempt... still declined. 
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Ed Jones(XLIX)

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Post your review completely in a new post along with a submission number and prove me wrong. Balls in you court. Put up or.........................
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Ed Jones(XLIX)

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Warning are NOT Allowed.
Parental guide has those warnings.
You don't get to reprint in your review content that is available elsewhere on the page for that title.
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Jeorj Euler

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You can never expect to achieve what you would like by being hostile to the powers that be.
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Emma Arpin

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It's been almost a year, and IMDb has not updated this policy. What's going on? Revealing trans people’s deadnames by listing it in the birth name section or in the case of credits, like Current Name (as Deadname), puts them at risk for discrimination in the film industry, other day jobs, housing, and their social life in general. IMDb is one of top google results for most people.

I realize that IMDb has a policy to publish and maintain “factual information,” but IMDb needs to take responsibility for how their service affects people for the rest of their lives. Many of the credits that get listed on IMDb are small projects, like youtube videos and student projects, which don’t really reflect someone’s professional work history. According to your system, a young person who volunteers as a PA or background actor, works on a student project, or youtube video, should be punished for the rest of their life, if someone happened to deadname them in the credits.

Similarly, publishing people’s deadnames in the “birth name” section of your site puts them at risk. IMDb assists third parties in discrimination, and it punishes trans people for sharing their experiences with the world through productions like Orange is the New Black, Pose, Transparent, and many smaller projects. The majority of trans people listed in your database are not celebrities known to the general public before transition, such as Caitlyn Jenner.

Until about a month or two ago, IMDb also had a policy that said, "We generally use people’s biological or surgically reassigned gender” to determine the designation of gender specific titles, like actor or actress. I saw that you changed this policy, after it was pointed out that it was at odds with Amazon’s own corporate stance. Amazon signed a letter in support of the trans community, following the legal erasure of trans people in the United States this past fall. IMDb, as a part of Amazon, needs to take responsibility for how the site affects the trans community. You can’t take credit for supporting the community, while ignoring the harm that your services cause.

There are simple solutions to this issue, such as allowing trans people under certain circumstances to update credits and/or the splitting of IMDb pages in limited cases. Additionally, there is no purpose, beyond selling gossip, in publishing trans people’s deadname in the “birth name” category of the site. This situation isn’t like actors who happen to take on a stage name or a maiden name.

(Edited)
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Ed Jones(XLIX)

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Not wrong.
This is not a democracy.
You are .6% of world population.
You are not even in a majority in a democracy!
There are for more pressing things in life.
And think about this........are you more entitled to alteration here than you would be if this was "The Washington Post", or CNN?
(Edited)
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Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

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Rob Sieger if anyone here sounds "unprecedentedly militant" it's you with your rhetoric about "powerful" special interest group bordering hate speech. 

My philosophy on that issue might seem odd, but I when you're trying to persuade majority to continue ignore minorities you should actually think about one simple thing: minorities is an outdated concept in itself. We should stop dividing people into groups, no matter how large or small and treat them individually, case-to-case. Of course, for society that for centuries used simplified idiotism that leads to segregation, discrimination,  and witch-hunting such ideas might seem to be to radical because they directly contradict our society's inherent vice of laziness and opposing changes. It's much easier to continue dividing people into groups and find some groups to oppose then actually confront yourself about the fact that differences are so scarce that effectively you might as well put yourself in the group and no one will notice.  

It is very much ironic since adaptibility is what made people so widespread and our ability to somehow supress our natural instincts (instincts, which in many cases prevent rational thinking in the modern world) is perhaps our only truly unique feature as a species. People pathologically don't want to change. They don't want to change their habits, their vocabulary, they oppose changes at every direction and every corner, not understanding a simple thing: changes are inevitable. 

P.S. I've also removed your double comment. 
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Rob Sieger

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Nikolay Yeriomin -- Thanks but you appear to have removed both. There is plenty Orwellian and dystopian about present-day United States, which is what I was referring to, and there are powerful special interest groups whose interests coincide with what the IMDb database was (apparently) created to compile. 

I am not 100% sure what "but I when you're trying to persuade majority to continue ignore minorities you should actually think about one simple thing: minorities is an outdated concept in itself" means, but I certainly agree that we should not divide people. That is what identity politics does. That is what Rory Roche's opinions of cis people are an example of. And that is why "transphobia" and "diversity" manias are but the tip of the iceberg of the destructive and divisive dystopia in which the US finds itself.
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Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

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I've deleted a duplicate of this one and it seems to be in place: 


And where exactly such example of behavior towards your situational enemy group came from?.. Of course minorities get angry and bitter overtime, turning to use exact same methods that opression does. I know because I am a minority in several different aspects: I have a diasbility, I am an internally dislocated person (a refugee but within one country) and I am also just plain too "weird" which in minds of too many people unties their hands and language in regards of harassment. That made me bitter and agressive towards anyone who tries to disregard other people's opinion. I hate to see that happen on both sides of any conflict. So far most of our society's attempts at fixing our problems is fighting fire with fire, which mostly doesn't work. 
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Jeorj Euler

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Faraday Speaks makes excellent points about the way radicalization via the Internet works and how halfway-informed identity politics exhibitionists and borderline fringe elements can be mistaken for "authority" by ordinary folks or others. In addition, he is right about how it may be a mistake for "progressives" and advocates of social "justice" to plainly write off conservatives, objectivists, libertarians and nationalists as foolish, delusional or insidious. On the other hand, he has not exactly clarified where he stands on the concept of cultural "authority", linguistic "authority", conceptual "authority", likewise dogma or so, and he may have set up two particular YouTube personas of the social "justice" advocacy flavor as substitute "authority", in the process of thanking them, and likely he owes them thanks in the context of guidance, but his presentation comes off as blind to the corruption that exists in the "left" regardless of how imperfect certain youthful pro-Trump loudmouths are.
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Ed Jones(XLIX)

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What is Faraday's law?
Learn what Faraday's law means and how to use it to determine the induced electro-motive force.
Google Classroom



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What is electromagnetic induction?
Electromagnetic induction is the process by which a current can be induced to flow due to a changing magnetic field.

In our article on the magnetic force we looked at the force experienced by moving charges in a magnetic field. The force on a current-carrying wire due to the electrons which move within it when a magnetic field is present is a classic example. This process also works in reverse. Either moving a wire through a magnetic field or (equivalently) changing the strength of the magnetic field over time can cause a current to flow.



How is this described?
There are two key laws that describe electromagnetic induction:

  1. Faraday's law, due to 19th century physicist Michael Faraday. This relates the rate of change of magnetic flux through a loop to the magnitude of the electro-motive force E\mathcal{E}E induced in the loop. The relationship is
    E=dΦdt\mathcal{E} = \frac{\mathrm{d}\Phi}{\mathrm{d}t}E=dt






dΦ​

The electromotive force or EMF refers to the potential difference across the unloaded loop (i.e. when the resistance in the circuit is high). In practice it is often sufficient to think of EMF as voltage since both voltage and EMF are measured using the same unit, the volt. [Explain]
The take-away point here is that a wire moving in a field does not necessarily represent an ideal voltage source; the voltage you might measure with a high-impedance voltmeter would only equal the EMF if the load is small.






Lenz's law is a consequence of conservation of energy applied to electromagnetic induction. It was formulated by Heinrich Lenz in 1833. While Faraday's law tells us the magnitude of the EMF produced, Lenz's law tells us the direction that current will flow. It states that the direction is always such that it will oppose the change in flux which produced it. This means that any magnetic field produced by an induced current will be in the opposite direction to the change in the original field.
Lenz's law is typically incorporated into Faraday's law with a minus sign, the inclusion of which allows the same coordinate system to be used for both the flux and EMF. The result is sometimes called the Faraday-Lenz law,
E=−dΦdt\mathcal{E} = -\frac{\mathrm{d}\Phi}{\mathrm{d}t}E=−dt

dΦ​

In practice we often deal with magnetic induction in multiple coils of wire each of which contribute the same EMF. For this reason an additional term NNNN representing the number of turns is often included, i.e.
E=−NdΦdt\mathcal{E} = -N \frac{\mathrm{d}\Phi}{\mathrm{d}t}E=−Ndt

  1. dΦ​




What is the connection between Faraday's law of induction and the magnetic force?
While the full theoretical underpinning of Faraday's law is quite complex, a conceptual understanding of the direct connection to the magnetic force on a charged particle is relatively straightforward.





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Emma Arpin

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This topic has been widely reported in the press at this point, and IMDb has yet to provide a response with substance. The only response so far from IMDb was a generic, short policy statement.

https://www.indiewire.com/2019/04/imdb-harms-transgender-actor-actress-birth-name-lgbt-1202055599/

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Kati Knitt

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@Emma: Their statement sounds a lot like the mails I got when I tried to contact IMDb, they have zero self awareness or interest in changing anything. They don’t really see a problem here at all.
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Ed Jones(XLIX)

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They are 100% aware that .6% is not a problem
They are 100% aware that the problem is psychosomatic.
When are you going to realize that if you chose to do "Anything" that there is going to be cause and effect in play. You can't ask anyone to protect you from a situation you chose and selected.
You can type all you want here and there. But you are changing ZERO.
Repeat..............you are changing zero.

Further replies should be considered inflammatory and categorized as spam.
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Jeorj Euler

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IMDb strives to represent an individual’s gender identity while also accurately reflecting cast and crew listings as they appear in a production’s on-screen credits at the time of original release.
The above statement is substance enough. People who do not like it would be wise to make every effort to get over it and also get used to the fundamental properties of the concept of publication.
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Kati Knitt

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Nope. Misgendering still hurts people and is inhumane.
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Jeorj Euler

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How is it inhumane that nobody can escape his or her published record? The same applies to everybody except for autocrats with the power to create a safe space that extends tens of thousands of square miles.
(Edited)
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Emma Arpin

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IMDb partially updated their policy, allowing trans people to remove their deadnames from the birth name category of the biography section of the site. The policy change applies to cases where they were not widely known to the public by their deadname. There is still a lot that needs to be changed with how IMDb treats trans performers and entertainment professionals, but this is a start.

https://variety.com/2019/film/actors/imdb-alters-policy-publication-birth-names-1203300451/
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Marco

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this is a start.

You might want to read some Orwell.
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Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

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Marco, not a fan of "1984" used as a comparison in modern times. Moreover, not a fan of surname Orwell associated exclusively with dystopia: man was an incredible writer, but people remember one book by him and fewer ever read anything else he wrote. 
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ACT_1 ⚠️

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? ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Orwell
Eric Arthur Blair (25 June 1903 – 21 January 1950),
better known by his pen name George Orwell,
was an English novelist and essayist, journalist and critic,
whose work is characterised by lucid prose,
awareness of social injustice, opposition to totalitarianism,
and outspoken support of democratic socialism.

As a writer, Orwell produced literary criticism and poetry,
fiction and polemical journalism;
and is best known for the allegorical novella Animal Farm (1945)
and the dystopian novel Nineteen Eighty-Four (1949).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Orwell_bibliography

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteen_Eighty-Four
- - -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utopian_and_dystopian_fiction
.

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Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

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ACT_1, the comment was caught in the spam filter, fished it out. 

Yes, I'm talking about that Orwell. That "best known" is a dangerous thing as it often gets people to think that it's the only important thing the person has ever done. I personally think that Orwell's essays are just as valuable as 1984, if not more valuable.
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Marco

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Marco, not a fan of "1984" used as a comparison in modern times.

Fair enough, but this whole situation just really reminds me of Winston's work where he constantly changes facts of the past into new "facts".

man was an incredible writer, but people remember one book by him and fewer ever read anything else he wrote.

I've so far only read 1984 and Animal Farm, but I did buy Burmese Days recently, so I'm getting there slowly but surely :)
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Luke Davies

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I thought imdb’s long standing policy was to never alter or delete accurate information...
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Jeorj Euler

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"It used to be..." Well, there have always been exceptions. The accurate information has to be relevant and non-abusive; possibly reasonably interesting as well. This is why there is a guideline about not posting information about people's children or their favorite colors, how many flower pots sit in the window seals of their houses. I'm glad that IMDb avoids what is known on Wikipedia as "instruction creep", but it is somewhat inevitable. Neither one is an indiscriminate repository of information.
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Jeorj Euler

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(The window sills even.)
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Marco

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there have always been exceptions.

Yeah, but these exceptions are there because they are so general that they don't really tell us anything about the person. Favorite colors and the like are shared with literally millions of people, it's hardly unique.
Specific information about a person (for example, a name a person was given around the time they were born) is extremely unique and can help identification along. (especially for people with a common name and no photos on IMDb).
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Marco

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there have always been exceptions.

Yeah, but these exceptions are there because they are so general that they don't really tell us anything about the person. Favorite colors and the like are shared with literally millions of people, it's hardly unique.
Specific information about a person (for example, a name a person was given around the time they were born) is extremely unique and can help identification along. (especially for people with a common name and no photos on IMDb).
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Jeorj Euler

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Might I remind you of the subject heading of this thread, Marco? A tort is being alleged.
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Luke Davies

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Just saying, if imdb starts caving in to everyone.. they will no longer be the Internet’s most reliable film database..
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Jeorj Euler

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Right, but I cannot really praise IMDb for reliability. It is crowd-sourced after all and, for many, kind of difficult to properly update. IMDb is renown for being the most comprehensive film database (quantity) the world has ever known, not necessarily the finest film database (quality).
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Luke Davies

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Well it’s incredibly well known and popular for a reason
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ACT_1 ⚠️

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 ? ?

http://www.imdb.com/pressroom/stats/
IMDb stats - Titles: 5,980,614 | People: 9,880,784 | Total Items: 336,394,426 (May 2019)

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795100/

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm10908100/

https://www.imdb.com/search/title/?release_date=1874-01-01, : 5,653,700 titles.

https://www.imdb.com/search/name?gender=male,female : 5,379,590 names.
- - -

No pages of Odd Numbers for Tites ?

The Effects (2020)
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795000/

The requested URL was not found on our server.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795001/

Rich and Jay Talk About The Boys (2019)
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795002/

The requested URL was not found on our server.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795003/

What Does MAGA Mean to You?/Ilhan Omar and Anti-Semitism in the Democratic
Party/Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez Attacks Washington Post Fact-Checkers. (2019)
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795004/

The requested URL was not found on our server.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795005/

Brighton and Hove Albion vs Liverpool (2019)
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795006/

The requested URL was not found on our server.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795007/

Catch the Wave Kodawari Navi (TV Series)
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795008/

The requested URL was not found on our server.
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795009/

Talking Normies Podcast! - Episode 12 - Hereditary!! (2019)
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt10795010/

.

(Edited)
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Jeorj Euler

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Amazon may be that reason. However, of course, what got Amazon interested in the first place is the pioneering aspect of IMDb, as there may have been nothing else like it (on the Internet) back in the early 1990s. Of course, I'm sure Blockbuster, Home Box Office, TV Guide, the studios, the cinemas and the libraries had somewhat extensive internal databases of movie information to accompany movie copies in stock, but they never really bothered to capture and publish the relationships among movies, casts, crews, other participants thereof and brands in a meaningful way. Thus, as it stands, IMDb is one of the only outlets that makes it easy (or at least easy to have the opportunity) to track professionals like stunt performers, set designers, prop designers, costume designers, special effects artists, makeup artists, lighting technicians, sound technicians, publicists etc. They may all get credit but not recognition the way that storytellers, directors, actors, cinematographers, musicians, singers, poets and animators and executive producers do.
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J.

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Jeorj Euler:

Yes, and if IMDb continues to use advances in tech, including AI, the database can continue to grow in size, scope and accuracy.

I am hopeful. IMDb has made many good decisions in recent years. Removing data for ideological reasons will never be among them.


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Bulma PunkRocker

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I support Trans people and address them in the way they feel represented as an individual, respectively, but after googling the term "Cis People" (I recognize my ignorance), I found this very offensive

Rory Roche

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Firstly, I didn't ask for the opinion of cis people...

It's basic common sense, if you don't respect the ones that are different from you, don't expect them to respect you. Not only regarding sexual identity, but in any aspect of life.

I excuse myself for reviving an old thread, but that sentence was very hateful and shocking to me, a simple (ignorant in this topic) human being.


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Ed Jones(XLIX)

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Cisgender
How dare anyone label anybody in any fashion.
One name for both sexes. The loony left is outta control.
Yeah, if you think for one minute a cop is EVER gonna get on his radio and say,
"I'M IN PURSUIT ON FOOT OF A CISGENDER OF UNDISCLOSED HEIGHT AND UNDISCLOSED WEIGHT AND UNDISCLOSED AGE"
Can't say what color skin. It's offensive.
Can't say what sex. It harms everyone's self esteem.
Can't say how tall. If they are short that self esteem thing creeps in again.
Can't say how much they weigh. If overweight or anorexic someone may be offended.
Can't say how old. Middle aged people may get offended if they overestimate your age.

Heaven forbid if you actually catch the criminal. They would probably sue you for being in better shape than they are.

Just how crazy is this going to get before the "Majority" in this country stops the minority fringe groups and an out of control academia from brainwashing the populace with their nonsense.
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Bulma PunkRocker

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I have do admit that in neither of my both countries, I have ever heard that term "cisgender". And I have friends in the LGBT community.
I don't mind if someone wants to label me that way, it's not my problem, it's theirs. But to act all offended and then offend someone with a "slur", rrejecting their opinion for their sexual identity, it's not helping the Trans community.

We need to relax and think about other people's feelings too, that would be my advise to Rory Roche.

Cheers!


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Derek Tombrello

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"Just how crazy is this going to get before the "Majority" in this country stops the minority fringe groups and an out of control academia from brainwashing the populace with their nonsense."

Oh great.... now you've done it. Don't you know that that is like a challenge to them?
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Ed Jones(XLIX)

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Yep I do
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Jeorj Euler

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Yeah, some transgender people believe that all cisgender people (non-transgender people) are incapable of understanding them. They may even claim that lack of representation of transgender people in government or public "authority" is necessarily a dire threat to transgender people. Regardless, I doubt any transgender legislator would be silly enough to cop an attitude with another legislator, right on the floor of the legislature chamber, purely on account of that other being cisgender. I doubt the same the other way around as well. It's too unprofessional. (Note: When if ever legislators belonging to the same legislative body start behaving extremely nasty toward each other on a regular basis, it is usually close before, all during or close after a period civil unrest.)
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rubyfruit76, Champion

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I stand in support of this actor and a change in policy and hope that IMDb will act on this and do the right thing -- and soon. 
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J.

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 I'm in favor of making this thread read-only.