When is an uncredited role not an uncredited role? In a YouTube video.

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If a director releases his film on YouTube and, while not including the credits in the actual film, posts the full cast and crew list in the description below the video, then can I safely assume these should all be "uncredited"?

That is what I'm going with but, as there are quite a few and after having to go back to fix a documentary I posted after this discussion, I want to make doubly sure before going any further. Who knows? As there is a bit of flexibility when dealing with what counts as a credit, then there might be some wiggle room on this angle too, especially if it is the kind of thing The Kidz are doing this days (along with their street dancing music and low slung trousers).
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Emperor, Champion

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Posted 7 years ago

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vhavnal

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Lol Emperor i figured you to be in early to late 20's not early 50's :P
Anyways, if the video ends without an end-credits, then if its an "official" youtube/facebook page, Its best to assume the credits they provided there (in comments or description section) are the 'official' one and those that are in the video but have not been credited will probably fall under "uncredited" but then, it depends on the inclusion criteria of the video and its genre....is that what you are asking?
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I think so yes ;)

The credits aren't at the end of the film but on the page the film was released on. I see this as being the equivalent of them screening such a film at a film festival and printing the credits in the festival program. If the film is seen out of the context of the YouTube page (and they can be embedded) then someone may never know who was in it - I only thought to check the description after I'd done a bit of detective work to piece the credits together.

Lol Emperor i figured you to be in early to late 20's not early 50's :P


These days I'm closer to my 50s than 20s and getting closer all the time!! Although I'm not quite such a fuddy duddy - I ain't no horn-5 ;)
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And MayorDefacto also chips in:

As far as I know, there is no accommodation made for YouTube videos that lack onscreen credits. As the opportunity exists to include credits onscreen, and there are numerous examples where that has occurred, I would view not crediting those involved in the production as a conscious decision by the "filmmaker", and thus anyone not listed onscreen in the video proper would be uncredited.

I recall one instance where someone asked on the CH board about the crediting on this title, Final Fantasy IX FanDub (2010), specifically why some of his updates had been rejected. The title consists of someone playing a video game and several "actors" reading aloud the onscreen captions. I had serious questions about the eligibility of the title itself, but that's a side issue. He was informed that because his voice actors weren't credited onscreen they couldn't be added without the uncredited attribute, and that because they had no existing credits, those uncredited roles would not be listed.

Noticing later that the names had appeared on the title page, I went back and re-checked the YouTube videos, and discovered the filmmaker had re-edited the episodes to include onscreen credits. Then with evidence to show, he was able to get the names approved. These kinds of shenanigans are too easy to accomplish. I think IMDb needs to look hard at the acceptance criteria for web based media and establish some solid verification rules. The way things are now, someone can swap out cast/crew names at will. If they have to do it onscreen, it'll at least take a bit of effort.


I hadn't thought about people swapping in a new version of the video and this would change the running time (by quite a bit here, as there are a lot of people - one of the reasons I assume they didn't add them in the first place).
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And, now it has gone live, it strikes me it can cause confusion because the full cast and crew link will be greyed out, giving more incentive to people to re-edit the film and add the credits into the title.
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Hi Emperor,

Just to confirm what you've guys already surmised correctly.

If a director releases his film on YouTube and, while not including the credits in the actual film, posts the full cast and crew list in the description below the video, then can I safely assume these should all be "uncredited"? 

Yes.

now it has gone live, it strikes me it can cause confusion because the full cast and crew link will be greyed out, giving more incentive to people to re-edit the film and add the credits into the title.

Can you point me to the title please?
I'd like to have a look.

cheers,
Lina

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Thanks for the confirmation.

OK:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3315328/

Cast hasn't gone live (as I messed up and submitted the extras as Other Crew, just before we got a reply from staff saying they should go in the cast) and some crew has yet to appear (obviously some won't appear at all, because they are the person's first credits) but I seem to recall from previous threads that this is what happens when everyone is uncredited.

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Thanks!
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The cast and crew (apart from the extras you will be re-submitting) are now live: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3315328/

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Cheers. I'll get on that now.
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All done:

131112-235311-151000

I've included everyone in the credits, as I assume that even if they don't have credits now these will sit on file until they do (plus if they add credits in the future...).

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DavidAH_Ca, Champion

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It seems to me that the worry that a film that is originally released on Youtube without credits may be released later elsewhere with credits is well-founded.

Would it not be a good idea to include a trivia item along the lines of
This video was first released on Youtube with no credit roll, so all cast and crew are uncredited.
in order to prevent well-meaning contributors from changing the list to all credited? It might even be worth-while adding it as a policy item in one (or more) of the Submission Guides.
(Edited)
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Its a good idea, although if they do re-edit the film and add the credits...